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Random outbreak of sentimentality

I found out today that someone I vaguely knew on a messageboard - and had vaguely known for years - had died unexpectedly at the age of 50. Which was sad.

Then I got into an argument with some idiot who thought that because we'd never met the guy and didn't know his real name, we didn't have the right to be sad, or to mourn. The thing is, he really didn't seem to understand that it's possible to care about someone you hadn't met in the flesh, or even someone you hadn't interacted that much with, but who was always around, part of the background texture of your life. He thinks that you can't connect emotionally in any way with just someone's words, and seems to find it weird that you'd even think of people online as real people, or think of them at all when you're offline.

Screw him. He's wrong. But he's inspired me to let you guys know that I think about all of you, and care about all of you, even if we don't interact that much. Hell, even if I read you but you don't read me. If I see a depressed or out of character post, or you disappear unexpectedly, I'll notice and I'll care, even if I never say anything. (I should comment more, I just never know what to say when things are bad.) And when things are going well for you, it makes me happy too.

Er, yeah. Sorry about that. Normal service will be resumed shortly.

..Now, in fact. Anyone who's read posts about Steven Moffat's takeover of the top Who job should read loveandgarbage's PSA on the subject and subsequently accept my profound apologies.



( 25 comments — Comment )
May. 22nd, 2008 02:11 am (UTC)
Sorry for your loss.... and it is a loss, no matter what anyone says. Just because you never met in person doesn't mean your thoughts or feelings about this person meant any less.
May. 24th, 2008 01:22 am (UTC)
Thank you :)
May. 22nd, 2008 02:15 am (UTC)
I've been online for 20-odd years and I've probably averaged around a death or so a year in the wider circle of online acquaintances. A few suicides - some expected, some not, a few deaths from long-term or sudden illness, a few accidents, and increasingly more than the odd death from 'old age' (one of the sites I'm very much involved with is dedicated to the history of motor racing, and a lot of the people on it are the guys who made that history - so there are a lot of guys up to their 80s there. While it's marvellous that they survived the sport's dangerous years one becomes very aware of their mortality now...).

A few of the deaths really shook me up - I was talking to one online friend who suffered from MS the day before she took her own life. There was no obvious indicator that she was going to do it - but she was having more and more 'bad days'. Her partner wasn't expecting it, none of her online friends were expecting it... but I still felt bad about not having spotted the non-existent evidence for years. A couple of deaths from natural causes have been people I was always going to get round to meeting 'sometime'. Sometime is never good enough.

There was another death recently that shook me; although it was someone I'd never actually met, I fell in with a fairly successful project writing about racing history via internet friends in the mid 90s, and found myself credited alongside one of the alltime great driver/engineer/journalists. That wouldn't've happened without t'internet, and Paul was already a hero of mine beforehand. He became even more of one after I felt that faint connection to him - my writing published and credited along with his. Paul was an exceptional man, still test-driving the world's most exotic and fastest cars into his late 80s - and when he died (after never quite recovering from his last accident a few years back) it hit me very hard.

In some ways taking an abstract view of the way the net connects people makes the disappearances even more poignant - you often think of how someone who's dead connected you into another part of your social circle, and you think of how that departure changes your life, changes the lives and interactions of everyone else who connected with them.

And of course online you leave more epitaphs behind in the virtual world than the real one.

(I have this terrible fear that my last visible net posting will be a link to a foreign company that has a name that sounds vaguely like a rude word in English. Should I shuffle off this mortal coil unexpectedly, could someone please hack my LJ and post at least a decent curry-house review?)
May. 22nd, 2008 02:24 am (UTC)
...and, to be fair, there's been the odd Internet death I've been less than distraught about. But that's the uk.* hierarchy for you. ;)
May. 24th, 2008 01:30 am (UTC)
I don't frequent many forums with a lot of older people on them, which I guess is why it hasn't happened as often to me. It has happened once or twice before, I think, but not a lot.

Ever since I was a kid I've made social networking graphs, although it's only just occurred to me to call them that. But I'd sit and draw out on huge bits of paper how everyone I knew was connected. And I can specify a couple of pivotal meetings which changed the course of my whole social life. In fact one of them was meeting an ex-boyfriend (in a computer lab, naturally); almost all my friends now can be traced back to people I met through him, although I'm not in touch with him at all now.

I'm not sure if I like the idea of leaving so much of a presence behind in the virtual world - I think I do, but it's also a bit disturbing. And yeah, I do have a bit of the "Those would have been TERRIBLE last words" fear myself, heh.
May. 22nd, 2008 02:50 am (UTC)
Right back at you. And, as is so often the case, you have echoed my thoughts/feelings. I know I should comment more (and I, too, never know what to say when things are bad, either), but I hope I've let those of you about whom I care very much know how I feel about each of you, and how much it means to me to know you in some fashion and have your words and experiences within my own sphere of existence.

So, um...yeah. Salud!
May. 24th, 2008 01:30 am (UTC)
And back at you again :)
May. 22nd, 2008 03:34 am (UTC)
Nicky and I really fell in love via email. In August we celebrate our fourth wedding anniversary. Internet feelings are real.
(Deleted comment)
May. 22nd, 2008 11:16 am (UTC)
Heh. Sometime I'm going to come to a post of a mutual friend and get the comment in first...
May. 24th, 2008 01:31 am (UTC)
And you, babe ♥
May. 24th, 2008 01:31 am (UTC)
Heh, yeah - I think it's because I know so many people like you that it shocks me so utterly when someone denies it.
May. 24th, 2008 04:25 am (UTC)
Yeah, we're one of three from the fffforde fffffffffforum, and that's just one site.
May. 22nd, 2008 06:39 am (UTC)
I agree with you, the guy is an idiot and I care about my online
friends too. *hugs*
May. 24th, 2008 01:32 am (UTC)
He is. And there were plenty of people telling him so, so hurray for that!
May. 22nd, 2008 06:59 am (UTC)
For me the last year has been a period of separation from those I love the most, what with flood, pestilence, the demise of CCDE and my own afflictions, Lj has been my major means of emotional contact with the world at large. I suppose there is a difference between those I have met and those who are "Virtual Friends" but it is not very great, we share things in common not least the slings and arrows, knowing that you are not alone is often half way to enduring the unendurable, and sharing in a small way the joys of my on-line friends brings light into my life and I hope I make some input into theirs. I know that when I am feeling down I write silly poems or make facetious comments on Lj and the thought that they may make someone laugh makes me feel better, the reader may have never met me but what has that to do with anything? It is a distraction. Those who know me well understand what I am doing, those who don't, take them at face value, does it matter either way? Your argument was pointless because "the idiot" is lacking the ability to empathize with others, it is his loss because he will be unable to feel the empathy of others when he needs it most.
May. 24th, 2008 01:33 am (UTC)
Re: Sympatico
Yes, you're absolutely right about virtual friends, and I suspect you're right about the idiot as well.

Your posts do often make me laugh :)
May. 22nd, 2008 08:41 am (UTC)
): We're allowed to be sad for who we damn well like to be sad for. *hug*

Also: my spelling, it sucks. xD
May. 22nd, 2008 10:41 am (UTC)
Yes, he's wrong. How can you argue against experience? A person you only know through the internet dies. You feel sad. that's what happened. No amount of argument is going to change that fact.
May. 24th, 2008 01:35 am (UTC)
This seems so obvious now, yeah. I was a bit sidetracked because he'd compared it to the Diana outbreak of mourning, which I tend to criticise myself, and I was trying to figure out what the difference was, or how it could be explained.
May. 22nd, 2008 10:59 am (UTC)
Ah, yes, because we're all just robots [dramatic eye-roll]

I feel the same way you do.
May. 22nd, 2008 09:54 pm (UTC)
we're all just robots

I knew it!
May. 24th, 2008 01:36 am (UTC)
Apparently, yes. I do not know why you would, as he does, spend all your time on a discussion forum arguing with robots, but there we go.
May. 22nd, 2008 11:50 am (UTC)
That guy's argument makes no sense. They're real people, they just live their life in another part of the world to you. It doesn't make your friendship any less worthwhile. At any rate, even if you find out that someone you see every day in real life, even if it's just a person who works somewhere you frequent, has died unexpectedly, then you have every right to feel sad. Why? Because this is human emotion. You feel sad for the loss of life.

To hell with that guy, he's an ass.
May. 24th, 2008 01:37 am (UTC)
I know! That was what confused me so much, that the argument just seemed bonkers. Like...of course they're real people. How can you even argue that?

It does just seem like a disturbing lack of human emotion...
May. 26th, 2008 02:39 pm (UTC)
*HUGS* I feel the same about internet friends too.
( 25 comments — Comment )


bad wolf
Notes from extinction

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